OK, so I followed the directions to install a demo of Mobile PC, and I followed the instructions to come up with an up-to-date version of MapSource. I even managed to download some free map data, install it into MapSource, and transfer it to Mobile PC and then get my position to show up via the BU-353.

However, now I'm stuck. From when I was doing my mapping on a Mac, I have the installer for City Navigator NT that was used to update the maps on my Nuvi. The installer has a directory called IMG that has a bunch of directories in it plus a LARGE file with a .gmap extension. Is there any way to move this mapping data onto my Windows machine, install it into Mapsource, and send it to Mobile PC?

Never mind. I searched around more on the forum and found that Garmin's crazy DRM scheme is going to force me into buying multiple copies of the same data if I go this route.

Garmin just lost a customer because of their draconian DRM. I'm off to uninstall all the Garmin stuff I just installed.

I don't understand your comment about Garmin's "DRM" forcing you to buy multiple copies of something for some reason. Could you elaborate a little?

In the mean time, if you have not ripped out all your hard work it's not terribly difficult to move that map data and make it available on a Windows PC. You just need to copy it into the appropriate folders and add a few simple entries in the Registry. If it's a copy of City Navigator that I have, I could even supply you with a .reg file to use. Of course if you've already done the drama queen thing....

...ken...

Basically, I have paid for the map data once by buying the Nuvi (implicit in the purchase price of the Nuvi) and using my free 60-day upgrade period to download current maps. By buying Mobile PC, which includes that special, already compiled map data that MapSource can't handle, I'd be paying for the same mapping data again (again implicit in the price). However, since I can't pull either of those map sets into MapSource, I'd have to buy mapping data a 3rd time so that I can have something to use in MapSource to create routes "by hand" since Mobile PC doesn't have the provision for drawing out routes other than the ones it calculates.

On one of the forums, someone said that Garmin is effectively in the business of selling unlock codes for maps, and I think that's really evident here. There's only one of me and I only need one map. Why can't I use that same map data to route plan, navigate via GPS on the laptop, or navigate via the Nuvi? USGS doesn't make me buy a separate topo quad for use at home on a desk, in a car, and on the trail.

I'd be interested in the reg change, I may as well test the software as long as I have the installers still downloaded. Having done it once, it's not that hard to trick the installer a second time. The map is City Navigator North America NT 2010. The IMG folder has the .gmap file in it as well as a bunch of folders with smaller files in them. If you could tell me how to move it over, I'd at least be interested in how the software works as a comparison to the other programs I'm trying.

Yes, Garmin is definitely in the business of selling maps. In some cases I think their product decisions are made by the marketing and sales people without regard for how we use them. In other cases I think they just didn't think things through.

A good example is the maps on SD cards. For some people they are the answer to their prayers. They only buy a single SD card and they can use it in any of their Garmin devices. They don't have to learn how to use Mapsource to manage and load maps and they don't have to have multiple unlock codes for multiple devices. But....

They end up in a situation like you, where they would have to buy a DVD copy of the maps if they want to use Mapsource for planning, working with tracks, managing waypoints, creating routes, etc.

We need a little more detail to see if it will be simple to move your maps.

Is the "City Navigator North America NT 2010.gmap" really a file? It's a folder in Windows. Specifically, it's this folder:

"C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\GARMIN\Maps\City Navigator North America NT 2010.gmap"

All of the necessary data is in folders under that folder in Windows. The attachment contains a snapshot of the folder structure under the .gmap folder. The numbered folders each contain a single .GMP file.

Does this look anything like the folder structure you have?

...ken...

Attached Images

ScreenShot006.jpg (49.8 KB)

Okay, that file structure under the .gmap folder looks identical to the Windows installation. It will be duck soup to just copy the .gmap folder and everything it contains to this path:

"C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\GARMIN\Maps\"

That will require you to:

1. Create a "GARMIN" folder in the "C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data" path.

2. Then create a "Maps" folder in the "GARMIN" folder.

3. Then copy the "City Navigator North America NT 2010.10.gmap" folder and everything in it into the "Maps" folder.

Now I just need to get you the registry entries.

...ken...

OK, done with the map move.

I don't think registry entries are required for that location. MapSource 6.15.6 should just find it.

Terry

I think you're right, Terry. The only registry entry I can find is the device code. But if Mapsource can see the maps and if the device is registered on Garmin's web site he should be able to get Mapsource to restore the unlock code.

Williaty, see if Mapsource can see the maps. If you have any problems, let us know with details and we'll see what needs to be done next.

...ken...

Mapsource does see the maps now. However, it claims they need unlocking. I didn't have an internet connection when I had time to play with it today, I'll try unlocking them tomorrow.

Alright, so I've got most of everything sorted out.

I'm still having no success at figuring out how to create a route in Mapsource, send the route to Mobile PC, and then drive the route in Mobile PC. I can create the route. I can send the route and have it claim to have transferred correctly, but I can't figure out how to get Mobile PC to activate the route and guide me along the route. What am I missing?


EDIT: Whoops, it was just kind of non-intuitive for me. I actually finally managed to find it in a help file and I'm good to go.

Hurray!!!!

I'm glad it works. Now for the slightly bad news. There is a quirk in Mobile PC that you can only transfer one route at a time from Mapsource. If you have two or more routes on the Routes tab in Mapsource and transfer to Mobile PC, it will look like they transferred. That is, when you go to activate the route you will see them all listed. But only the first one is correct. The rest will have the correct name but they will all have the same route as the first one.

I've reported this to Garmin. Who knows when it will be corrected. It's something I can live with. It's just one of those things that if you aren't aware of it it will drive you until you figure it out.

The good news is that you can transfer multiple waypoints and they will all go correctly into your Favorites, complete with the selected icons.

...ken...

Well, I have now tried all the major mapping programs available for Windows that can be used both for route planning and for in-car direction giving. My take on the whole situation?

Sounds like you are somewhat picky. Is there something in particular none of them will do that you must have?

Terry

Well, all of them have specific things they get right and all of them have specific things they get wrong.

For instance, I like the interface of S&T2009. It makes sense to me. There's some quirks, sure, but I can work with it. It's even doable to use it in moving-map mode to find your way around detours and traffic. However, its in-route display is rubbish (several displays I use aren't there) as are its text-to-speech warnings/alerts.

SA2010 has a pretty darned good in-route display, with all the information I'd like, but it just makes me pull my hair out to work with it as an actual map for route planning or working around obstacles in real time.

Garmin Mapsource+Mobile PC does a decently good job of presenting the information I want (a few things missing) and has the best audible alerts/warnings. The route planning in Mapsource is workable. However, it's nearly impossible to manually route yourself around trouble in real-time due to the interface of Mobile PC.

I think, honestly, that I've been spoiled by the navigation programs I was using on the Mac. I was using Google Maps+Earth to do route planning and creation. Then I was exporting them as .kml which I used GPSBabel+ to translate into .gpx files. Those files could then be loaded into GPSRouteX, which would warn me when I was approaching a waypoint, count me down into it, and then read me the comment (which contained the direction to turn). We had to resort to paper maps if we were forced away from our planned route.

So, we wanted to pick up the ability to carry fewer paper maps (right now we have one DeLorme Atlas for each state, adds up on a long trip), have the ability to visually work around trouble via the digital maps, have it read the route out loud to me and do this all under Windows because we got a deal on an Eee PC that we can leave permanently in the car.

I guess I want the route-creation interface and visual map interface of Google Maps, the on-screen display of SA2009, and the text-to-speech and audible warnings/advisories from my little Garmin Nuvi (Mobile PC does not do the same).


Yeah, I'll freely admit to being picky

Williaty,

I agree with your general reaction completely. While some of my nits and picks are different than yours, as will always be the case, it's also my reaction that I need pieces from at least three or four different programs, and even then there would be at least a couple or three things I wouldn't get that I want.

Indeed!!!

For the record, despite all the goodies I have to play with, when I went on a two-week trip through the Rockies to the Left Coast at the end of May, it was my venerable reliable old Garmin iQue 3600 that took it's usual place of authority in its mount on the dash.

For working around jam-ups and detours on the fly, I just start detouring and let the iQue auto-reroute me as necessary. Garmin's route recalculation is pretty good. And it's pretty patient; recalculating as much as necessary as I hit additional blockages that I need to work through or around. I expect your Nuvi isn't half bad at doing that, too.

...ken...

Mobile PC can do everything the Nuvi can do (or the iQue for that matter) and provides a lot more screen. The problem is mounting the laptop in a reasonable location. I compare my Nuvi and UMPC with Mobile PC every chance I get. If the UMPC had a brighter screen and was loud enough to hear in the truck, it would be no contest.

Your Mac set up meant you spent most of your time just preparing to use it. Certainly an advantage when you like tinkering and laying it out your way. However, any of the programs you mentioned can do most of what you were setting up with virtually no input. They were designed by someone else so may not have your specific needs but they are light years ahead for people that want to get from here to there by the best method possible with the least tinkering.

Terry

Oh, yes, I'm sure they're ideal for people who just want to get from A to B.

However, for my own personal travel and because I lead car tours, I want to get from A to B in the most interesting way possible which usually has nothing to do with the shortest or fastest way to get there.

Comparing Mobile PC to the Nuvi, the OSD isn't quite the same and the voice alerts aren't the same at all. I was actually quite surprised how different they were.

If I transfer routes one at a time from Mapsource to Mobile PC, can I load Mobile PC with multiple routes and have them all work as intended?

Yes.

If you want to keep all the routes in Mapsource as a backup or for reference/revision later, the easy way to do it is open the .GDB file with the routes in it, delete all except the one you want to transfer and transfer it. Just don't save the file.

If you don't care about saving anything, just create a route, transfer it, delete it from the Routes tab, create another and repeat. It's so easy to create routes in Mapsource that it's not much of an issue either way.

...ken...

Can you help me with the same trouble? I have all these files in gmp format in the required folders, but I need them to be a number and then "img" at the end, so I can use them in mapsource. Let me know if this can all be set up to load like the DVD somehow, Thanks.

You just need to get an up-to-date version of Mapsource. The current versions of Mapsource will find those maps if they are in the location I described (for Windows XP). It looks for them there.

...ken...

I don't have XP, I have Vista home premium. I have used something to convert them from gmp to img. Now they are all in a folder numbered and ending in img, but I can only send them to my eTrex venture HC. When the process is done, the GPS unit tells me maps are locked, in red highlight form. Mapsource will not open them either, and they all end in "img"!

Any help for unlocking these img files? Or using them somehow? I only have an USB on the back of the unit, no SD card can be used with my unit.

So everything is actually working exactly as it should. The original maps must have been in their correct location for you to reverse convert them.The converted maps must be where they are supposed to be because Mapsource finds them and lets you load them to your GPS. And the GPS finds them when they are loaded to it.

You just need to unlock them in Mapsource. If you don't have the unlock code written down somewhere you can get it from your MyGarmin account. Once you have unlocked them you should reload them to your Venture and they will work.

...ken...

I do not have a my Garmin account. These are maps I downloaded, then converted. They are from the Internet. If they are locked but still in img format, is there any other way around all this, without paying $100.00 for the DVD? The files are here, it's just that they are apparently locked or something. Once again, they are from the net, converted, loadable through another software program, but locked when they arrive to my GPS.