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Bad NMEA implementation in Microsoft Streets and Trips?
longjohn119
It's the ONLY conclusion I can come to. I enabled the GPS on an Acer One with the UNDP-1 Gobi 1000 module, and it just won't work with Microsoft Streets and Trips 2006.

BUT (And it's a BIG BUT)

Not only does it work just fine with 3 much more advanced GPS mapping programs I have (OziExplorer, Fugawi Marine, Dr Depth), I can run all three at the same time AND all three are also reading the NMEA Depth Sentence from my Garmin Fishfinder.

I also tried it with a couple of other GPS mapping programs including one written in .NET and they all work just fine

Only Streets & Trips 2006 doesn't work.

CONCLUSION: Bad NMEA implementation whether Microsoft wants to admit it (or better, yet actually do something about it) or not.
t1d
I take it from your post that you have some experience with setting up a gps receiver to "talk" to a navigation program. So, I assume that you have properly configured all three settings; Com Port # (common to both GPS and Nav Program), GPS Baud rate set to 4800 and GPS Refresh Rate set to 1/second. If that is the case, maybe you would like to give some details about the error statements that you are receiving from Streets & Trips. Someone might have additional thoughts/clues to offer as help.
Marvin Hlavac
I, too, wonder if the baud rate may be an issue. Microsoft Streets and Trips can only use the 4800. There are increasing numbers of GPS receivers on the market today, which default to higher baud rates. It would be nice to see future versions of Streets & Trips (and AutoRoute, and Mappoint) supporting higher baud rates (and higher refresh rates).

In the mean time, use GPS Gate as a work-around for the baud rate issue.
SpadesFlush
It's the ONLY conclusion I can come to. I enabled the GPS on an Acer One with the UNDP-1 Gobi 1000 module, and it just won't work with Microsoft Streets and Trips 2006.

...

Only Streets & Trips 2006 doesn't work.

CONCLUSION: Bad NMEA implementation whether Microsoft wants to admit it (or better, yet actually do something about it) or not.
Time for an up-grade. How about downloading a trial version of Streets and Trips 2010 and reporting back on whether or not you have the same problem?
longjohn119
Everything is set 4800,8,N,1 across the board. Xport, Fugawi and OziExplorer all report it as a 4800 baud NMEA stream

I used a port monitor on the port and can't see where it's none compliant with the NMEA 2.0 spec. I even used an NMEA filter between the port and S&T to no avail.

Unfortunatley Microsoft dumbed down the GPS interface and you have absolutely no control over it. This is not a Show Stopper, this machine will mainly be used as a chartplotter and depth plotter for fishing/boating, I only bought S&T as a cheap way to replace a Pharos GPS puck and it's not really worth chucking out any more money to use it once or twice a year. I'll probably just make my own maps for Fugawi and take advantage of it's 3D view.

Netbook To Chartplotter Project
longjohn119
The latest version of S&T gives no relief because they haven't changed the GPS interface one lick

In fact other than updated maps and a few fancier icons on the buttons I can't see any differences, I certainly wouldn't consider it an upgrade except for the map data. (Maybe the routing actually works now but I not wasting my time messing with it if it's not going to work anyway)

It's the ONLY GPS mapping program I can't get to work, OBVIOUSLY a problem on Microsoft's part, they have to dumb down everything to the point it becomes unusable while programs written by hobbyists using Microsoft's own API's managed to get it right

Go figure, huh?
tcassidy
Yes, the bit rate is limited. Maybe you should just consider another GPS or try GPS Gate. Others are able to use S&T without all the problems you are experiencing.

Terry
longjohn119
Trying another GPS kind of defeats the point of having GPS built in especailly when every other program I use and use much more often works just fine

Tried Franson, didn't change a thing

EVERY other program identifies it as NMEA at 4800 baud, I placed monitors in between and there isn't a thing about the data that's out of NMEA specifications, just your standard GPVTG, GPRMC, GPGSA, GPGGA, and GPGLL data, lines beginning with $ and ending with a carriage return and a two digit checksum preceded by a * There is a bug in the program which Microsoft refuses to acknowledge because it probably only happens to a handful of people. It's cheaper to lose a few customers than fix a rare bug

S&T won't accept the connection but the reason is obviously other than what they claim which is not surprising given Microsoft's long history of error messages that don't have anything to do with the real problem

It's simply not worth my pursuing anymore, S&T isn't much worth in a boat where this unit will mainly be used. I just thought it would be nice to be able to use in in my truck once or twice a year since I already had the program. My main interest was to get it working for others who are following my blog

Netbook To Chartplotter Project
tcassidy
Maybe it would be more helpful if you could tell what the bug is that won't allow S&T to work with the Gobi. You say the sentence structure is standard, data rate is 4800 and refresh rate is 1Hz. If you can monitor it that closely, you should be able to see what the Gobi does different from other GPS. I don't have one and can't see how I would ever have one to test.

Terry
MisterMoonlight
I am using S&T from many versions with the pharos receiver without any problem and it is working also with many other software. We cannot make a conclusion that the NMEA implementation of S&T is bad just because one device is not working with it correctly. The other softwares you are talking about that are working with the Gobi may have a more relax implementation that ignores some inconsistencies that may appear in the data.

Only a compare between data provided by two receivers (one that is working or not), or by looking at the NMEA data carefully can help doing a conclusion.

One thing i know of S&T sensitivity regarding GPS unit, if one having a broken cable that have intermittent failure, S&T serial communication can hang on it. But i am not sure it is related to NMEA in anyway. It could be just related that the serial communication cannot easily recover from communication problems...
longjohn119
But I can make that diagnosis when it works with every other program I've tried (over a dozen) and only Streets and Trips doesn't work

Basic troubleshooting knowledge tells me the problem is with Streets & Trips, obviously

Of course the Pharos unit works with it but again that defeats the purpose of having a built in GPS without cords from USB ports getting in the way

Besides Streets & Trips isn't much use in a boat so it's really not worth my while to pursue it any further
longjohn119
Maybe it would be more helpful if you could tell what the bug is that won't allow S&T to work with the Gobi. You say the sentence structure is standard, data rate is 4800 and refresh rate is 1Hz. If you can monitor it that closely, you should be able to see what the Gobi does different from other GPS. I don't have one and can't see how I would ever have one to test.

Terry
That's just it, there isn't a bit of difference between the data from the Pharos unit and the Gobi 1000 unit. The problem is NOT with the NMEA stream, Microsoft just pops up that error message because it's probably the only one there is, the catch all error message. I think we have all seen that problem with Microsoft's error messaging over the years.

I suspect the problem is there is no entry made in the Device Manager for virtual ports so S&T rejects it no matter if the NMEA stream is compliant or not. That is the ONLY difference I can find between the Gobi and Pharos GPS
Marvin Hlavac
longjohn119, I looked through your above posts, but I don't see what error message you got from S&T. I might have overlooked it, or you might have mentioned it already in another thread. Also, does the built-in GPS receiver include a software driver that creates a virtual com port? Without it, Streets & Trips will not be able to see the GPS receiver.
tcassidy
If there is no COM port, probably none of the other programs could find it either. But you are right - if there is no COM port, S&T won't find it. And neither will Mobile PC, iGuidance or GPS Gate. Can't say for sure about Street Atlas but it is unlikely.

Terry
longjohn119
It says the stream is not NMEA 2.0 compliant but it is. Let's be realistic though, just because the error message says that is the problem doesn't necessarily mean that it is the real problem, it's just a standard one size fits all error message. I think that anyone who has chased down an odd error on a computer has found that sometimes the error message given has nothing to do with the actual error.

It does see the port, it will hook to the port but then kicks it after a second. I think it's looking for a Serial Port entry in the Device Manager and when it doesn't see one it disconnects no matter if the NMEA stream is compliant

Since I rarely use S&T anyway (I bought it originally for $40 to replace a defective Pharos puck I had that Pharos wanted $100 to replace) as this is mainly a marine/fishing setup, it's not worth my pursuing any longer, I guess I'll just have to use the included Pharos unit when I use it once or twice a year on an out of town trip.

Netbook To Chartplotter Project
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