Transferring Detail Maps from Mapsource to Mobile PC

Julian, as far as I understand it, you cannot get the map off of a Mobile PC DVD to use for any purpose. It's in a "compiled" form that can't be "uncompiled" (or something like that, Ken in Regina will have the correct terminology).

Perhaps you've realised this already but you will not be able to use the copy of City Navigator Europe 2008 you have on your Mobile PC DVD to load into MapSource. You will have to get a new, map only, DVD of City Navigator Europe 2008 (as you've suggested in the quote above) to install into Mapsource so you can then install the maps into your North American version of Mobile PC as Ken in Regina has outlined above.

Thanks to both both Kens for your help. I think it is clear that the maps on the Mobile PC DVDs are in some compressed format and cannot be installed into MapSource. If you run the installation program it starts to install Mobil PC + maps, not the maps alone. I think the way forwrd for me is to buy a copy of City Navigator Europe NT 2009 maps on DVD and to install through MapSource as Ken describes.

I thought you would be interested to hear that I have just spoken with Garmin Europe Support and was connected to an "expert" on Mobile PC. He denied categorically that additional maps can be added to Mobile PC and said that Garmin were working on it for a future release but had no idea when that would appear. He also said that they were working on a fix to install multiple copies of Mobile PC on a single PC, which I can confirm is not possible with the current versions. I must say that I have been very disappointed with the lack of knowledge that Garmin have demonstrated on their own products - it is not what I would have expected from a big name company. Without a forum like this there would be total mis-information. Regards, Julian.

I (for one) have City Navigator® North America NT 2009 installed in Mobile PC, along with Topo Canada V2. They work together just fine. Mobile PC is set up to allow a check box to use one or the other as required by your needs.

Garmin should make this forum required reading for their Mobile PC "experts". Or at least Ken in Regina and Terry and Marvin's posts.

To be fair to the good people at Garmin, we could look at any software product by any company, and we would very likely find at least one online user community that knows a thing or two about the software that even the tech support doesn't . However, there will always be much more stuff that we don't know, and that's why we would welcome if one day a person (or a few) from Garmin joined us here to discuss various aspects of GMPC, just like people from other companies do. And if they ever feel it appropriate, they certainly could refer some of their customers to this user community for additional info.

Ken in Cape Breton,

Thanks for catching that about the Mobile PC maps. I just plain missed that in Julian's post. You are 100% correct. I thought, from my misreading of it, that he had received a DVD with the actual City Navigator maps and went barrelling on from that perspective. Ooops ...

Julian, as Ken said, we have already, as a group, proven multiple times that it is absolutely possible to add maps to Mobile PC. Ken is not the only one who has done it. Terry and I have also added Topo Canada. I've also added another set of detailed Canadian topos (Ibycus Topo v2.1). And I've added the latest version of Metroguide Canada (v5). None of these maps are locked, so I can load them onto any Garmin navigation device.

Some of the participants in here from other parts of the world have done the same. Some with Garmin-supplied maps (City Navigator Australia, for instance) and others with Garmin-compatible maps that they have either purchased or that have been made available freely by volunteers who have mapped their local regions and are sharing the results.

The only difference from Ken and Terry and I is, in your case the maps you need to use (City Navigator Europe or North America) are locked and require an unlock code.

The Mapsource unlock wizard will apply the unlock code to the maps. When you compile the maps to load them into Mobile PC, Mapsource will embed some sort of identifier in the compiled maps. When Mobile PC tries to use those maps it will look for that identifier and then it will look to see if the Unit ID of the GPS receiver matches. If it does, it will happily use those maps.

The biggest problem most people, include Garmin's techs, seem to have understanding this is that the version of Mobile PC that comes bundled with a GPS receiver works and acts exactly like any Garmin mobile navigation device. That is, from the perspective of adding maps, you can treat it EXACTLY like a Nuvi or eTrex or Zumo or StreetPilot. The unit ID is provided by the GPS10x or GPS20 that comes bundled with it.

All it requires is that one think of the Mobile PC and the bundled GPS receiver as a single inseperable unit. Or think of a Nuvi as being the result of someone cramming the Mobile PC software right inside a GPS20 and adding a screen.

...ken...

I'm astonished that Garmin would be so stupid as to commit resources to developing that capability. Or that they are planning to treat their customers that badly.

It's not necessary. All the customer needs to get coverage of other parts of the world is to buy the maps and unlock them to the GPS receiver that came bundled with their Mobile PC.

Allowing multiple copies to be installed means the customer will be told to buy another copy of Mobile PC, which will mean - like you - they'll end up buying another receiver that they don't need.

How irresponsible is that??!!!

Speaking of other receivers and multiple maps on the same Mobile PC installation, are you up for a bit of experimenting? All in the cause of adding to our collective body of knowledge about Mobile PC and how it handles maps.

Here's my theory (and I would appreciate if anyone else can blow some holes in it). The GMAPPROM.IMG file is the preloaded maps that came with Mobile PC. I'm guessing that you can switch mapsets from North America to Europe by simply copying the right set of maps into the Mobile PC folder and turning on the matching receiver.

Would you be interested in trying this? You will need two additional folders, one containing the GMAPPROM.IMG file from the North America version and one containing the GMAPPROM.IMG file from the Europe version. Name the folders so you can't confuse them.

The experiment requires you to copy the GMAPPROM.IMG file from the Europe folder into the Mobile PC folder, turn on the Europe receiver and fire up Mobile PC. See if Mobile PC is happy with the maps.

Shut down Mobile PC and the receiver, copy the GMAPPROM.IMG file from the North America folder into the Mobile PC folder, turn on the North America receiver and fire up Mobile PC again.

If my theory is correct, Mobile PC should be happy as long as it sees the right maps with the right receiver. But there might be something else that would prevent this. It would be interesting to find out, if you're up for some experimentation to help the cause.

During the testing, there is one hiccup you'll run into. If you are presently in the UK, when you do the North America test your receiver is still going to locate your present position in the UK, so you won't see the North America detail maps. All you will see at your UK location will be the basemap, which won't have much detail.

To satisfy yourself that Mobile PC is actually using the detail maps, you'll have to click Browse and scroll the map over to North America (anywhere on the east coast will do), then zoom in to a level that will prove that it's using the detail maps.

If you get a few minutes, and the nerve, to try this, please let us know how it works out.

...ken...

Ken,
I am concerned that we may be getting beyond what we are able to test. All we know for sure is non-locked maps that can be opened with MapSource 6.13.7 can be loaded into Mobile PC. At least one other poster has said they could load a locked map (via 6.13.7) to the version of Mobile PC equipped with a GPS. Another poster verified that maps could be transferred with newer versions of MapSource by going around the apparent folder error in 6.14.1 and 6.15.3. I have determined that CNNA NT2009.1 uses an entirely different file format which can't be opened by 6.13.7.

I can't test whether 2009.1 maps can be used by Mobile PC even if I could transfer them as they are locked to my Nuvi. Is it possible Garmin is truly moving away from this approach? The market for people using Mobile PC on more than one continent is limited. Maybe they don't wan't to pursue it or feel having 2 different Mobile PC versions on one computer is the answer.

Terry

You will find the following outlined in other posts but I'll put it here because it's relevant:

Once you have other maps successfully installed into Mobile PC you need to decide which one you wish to use. The main map supplied with your Mobile PC installation will take precedence over any other maps you have installed, or at least that's how it works if the different maps are for the same part of the world.

To choose which map to use, use the "Tools" button off the main screen, then select "Manage My Data", then "Map Sets" On the resulting screen you will have a couple of buttons at the bottom, "Back" and "MapSource". The "MapSource" button only appears if you have additional maps loaded into Mobile PC. When you select "MapSource" you will go to a screen showing the various maps installed with checkboxes to the left. Make sure there is a check mark next to the map you wish to use. If you wish to use a map other than the main map you need to uncheck the main map or it takes over. Or something like that.

Oh yes, don't forget to look at the "Similar Threads" Marvin has running at the bottom of each forum page. Lots of good relevant stuff appears there.

Hi Terry,

The stuff you laid out is all useful knowledge that has helped us get a pretty good handle on how Mobile PC works. And to speculate how it might work in a situation we haven't yet been able to test.

The only way we will be able to add to the knowledge is if we can get empirical testing done by folks who have the necessary versions of the program. If Julian is willing to play guineau pig with the stuff he already has, it costs him nothing except some time and will add some very useful information to the pile.

Even if my theory is totally wrong, it's worthwhile for us to find that out.

As for the Lifetime Updates being different, that's something I expected. They are intended to be incremental updates so it makes sense that Garmin must handle them differently. I'm not yet prepared to accept that it's a new format for all future map products, until the next version of City Navigator is released and we see how it looks.

As for the differences in the most recent two versions of Mapsource, I'm not yet prepared to accept that they are anything other than bugs. I say that because Garmin has broken other file paths, too. It can't find any custom icons you have created in earlier versions, for instance. And they've broken a bunch of other, unrelated, things. General conscensus around the net is that the most recent two versions are just really bad programming and until Garmin gets the really obvious stuff cleaned up it will be very difficult to assume any new directions from the way those versions behave.

But I think I have been wrong before ... maybe once...

...ken...

Ken.

I have just tried your test and it does work. I took the EU version of GMAPPROM.IMG out of the folder C:\Program Files\Garmin\GarminMobilePC and put it on my desktop. I then copied the GMAPPROM.IMG from North America into the EU Mobile PC and started it up with the North America 20X. Initially you get a flashed message "Cannot unlock maps with Unit Id ..." and it then goes to a screen asking "Did this purchase of Garmin Mobile PC include a Garmin GPS receiver?". If you click "Yes" it tells you to connect the 20X. Click "Done" and you're away as normal. I browsed over to the US and the full NT North America map detail is available (with the GPS correctly locating me in the UK superimposed on the base map).

I then reversed the process and put the EU GMAPPROM.IMG back into the EU Mobile PC folder with the North America 20X. This time you get the "Cannot unlock maps with Unit ID ..." and there is no escape. As soon as I put the European 20X back on the EU Mobile PC worked as normal.

I will buy City Navigator Europe 2009 NT maps on DVD and load them up with MapSource and let you know how I get on.

Regards, Julian.

Rename the GMAPPROM.IMG for Europe to GMAPSUPP.IMG and put into the Mobile PC folder for North America. Then see if you have both maps available and unlocked. You may be missing one of the basemaps though

I think I have that the right way round. Make sure you keep a copy of the original GMAPPROM.IMG.

Terry

Julian,

Thanks for doing the test. It's great that it worked mostly as I had guessed it might. At least with the current situation it would save you from having to reinstall Mobile PC whenever you make a transcontinental trip. It does confirm that it's the mapset and the receiver that are tied together and there is only a minor hitch getting Mobile PC to allow you to switch, as long as you use them together.

It should also mean that you would be able to maintain a single Favorites file and saved routes and custom POIs. ... Actually that would be an interesting follow-on test (after you try Terry's). Would you mind putting a couple of entries into your Favorites, making sure you get their locations (do a search on an address and then add it to your Favorites) and maybe create a route and save it? Then switch map files and receivers and see if you can still access those Favorites and the saved route?

Terry,

That will be a very interesting test. I'm hesitant to make a prediction how Mobile PC will react. We know that Mobile PC is happy to use both GMAPPROM.IMG and simultaneously a GMAPSUPP.IMG. But...

You can only connect one GPS receiver at a time and each mapset is "tied" to its own receiver. So....

Will Mobile PC accept the mapset for whichever receiver you have turned on and connected to Mobile PC at the moment and simply ignore the other mapset? If it works, all you need to do is switch receivers to switch maps. Or...

Will Mobile PC get its knickers in a twist and refuse to accept either mapset? Or...

Will it work fine with the GMAPPROM.IMG file but refuse to accept a GMAPPROM.IMG pretending to be GMAPSUPP.IMG?

Interesting...

...ken...

Terry, just a point of clarification, Mobile PC has only one basemap. It's a world basemap. You can test this by scrolling west from your location on the Left Coast and you will eventually bring up Russia or China or Japan, depending upon how straight west you pan. Or just do a search for a large city in some other part of the world.

I've used it for answering questions when we've been talking about issues in a variety of locations, like Dubai and Australia. I've been pleasantly surprised at how much useful information is in the basemap. Also, the basemap contains DEM data so if you zoom out far enough to switch from the detail map to the basemap view, you get a nice relief view of the map. At least you do for North America. I don't know how much of the rest of the world it has DEM data for. Perhaps this is something else Julian can tell us.

...ken...

The results of Terry's test were interesting.

Both North America and European maps were loaded into Mobile PC North America - you could see them in "System\Mapsets". When I first ran it up with the North America 20X, Mobile PC started without complaint and the GPS found my location fine in the UK. Only the North America maps were unlocked but the world basemap was fine. When I went into the maps selection and chose the European maps it said that it could not unlock them with the GPS Unit ID, which I guess is what you expected.

I then attached the European 20X and re-started the North America Mobile PC. This time there was a message that it could not unlock a mapset with the current Unit ID. This turned out to be the North America maps but the European maps were unlocked and worked fine. Again the world basemap was fine.

Routes and favourites were not transferred - these were preserved from the North America Mobile PC. I tend to use Favourites when I am travelling and later enter them as Custom POIs using the POI Loader so this would make stored locations available in all situations. This would not apply to routes though.

This does mean that you could swap maps by swapping the 20X GPS, which is a great step forward, but it would still be good to have both mapsets active at the same time. I guess the only answer is the credit card !!!

Regards, Julian.

Sorry I didn't answer Ken's query about DEM data. I don't know what this stands for but obviously it is the 3D relief view. This is complete throughout Europe just as it is for North America.

Regards, Julian.